55 thoughts on “Metro bus service changes implemented Sunday, June 17, with improved connections to Expo Line”

1. “The monthly pass system is just a scam to dupe the poor and the uneducated.”

   The poor would be eligible for Metro’s subsidized pass program and those still being educated (high schoolkids, college students) also get discount passes, bringing down per mile charges even more. If you’re worried about the uneducated though, look at LAUSD, not Metro, but that’s neither here nor there.

   Also, look at average trip length and average fare paid, as well as the average cost of driving, and put your math into context.

   But even with your assumptions, even with a 5 mile commute (assuming this person is only going to work and doing absolutely nothing else), $900 a year to cover your transportation needs is a wonderful deal. Assuming a full-time minimum wage job (few heads of households actually work at the minimum wage, though, but let’s go along with this), that $900 a year represents 5% of your pre-tax earnings.

   Considering that such a person would be exempt from federal and state income taxes, and be eligible for special programs, such as the EITC (a huge bump if they have children), medical care for their children, food stamps for their children, school meals for their children (2 of 3 meals every school day), they will end up consuming more tax benefits than the taxes they pay. I’m not saying that’s necessarily a bad thing, but let’s be real here. The usual measures of poverty do not include these transfers.

   Though there may be disagreements over the service changes, I see no way that the poor are getting screwed by the public transportation system in terms of what it costs to use. I think distance-based fares are promising for other reasons, but not because I think the transit dependent are getting a bad deal. Not at all.

2. @ Frank M

   A good car insurance cost about $60 per month add in the cost of gasoline of $80-100 per month for a 10 mile commute (20 mile round-trip), regular maintenance ($100 per for a responsible person) and parking fees where applicable and the $75 monthly pass starts looking like a good bargain for people. Add in the non quantifiable benefits of using transit that one can’t do while riding a moped or a bike, like free time to read, listening to music, being productive on your smartphone/tablet, or just having time to relax and wind down while not dealing with traffic and the $75 seems like money well spent in my opinion.

3. Mospeada et al,

   I would encourage you to use the AAA’s standard for calculating the cost of operating a car: about 60 cents per mile for sedan and 75 cents per mile for SUVs.

   These figures include all those important factors like gasoline, repairs, maintenance, insurance, depreciation, etc.

   Carter Rubin
   Contributor, The Source

4. Does anyone know the best bus to take to the Los Angeles Mormon Temple from the Culver City Expo station? Would like to use Expo when going to serve in the temple. Thanks

5. Eugene,

   I think your best option would be taking the Big Blue Bus #12 which goes from Culver City Station to UCLA via Westwood Boulevard. You would get off at Santa Monica Blvd. and Westwood Blvd. and then walk the four or so blocks to the temple. I think that’s your best bet.

   Here’s that route on Google Maps for reference: http://goo.gl/maps/onQ7

   Carter Rubin
   Contributor, The Source

6. And again, AAA data is based on an average of 10,000 mi driven per year. If one drives less than that, especially on a more fuel efficient vehicle (Nissan Leaf, look ma’ no gas!) , the annual per cost mi will be much more different.

   And no, a car is also not the only way to get around town. People can easily switch to motorcycles and scooters just like how people get around in Taipei and Bangkok. In the end, the monthly pass is a scam to dupe poor people to rely on the bus for shorter rides; they are not getting any better deal.

7. Frank M,

   Fair point on the mileage. But the fact that more people do not use motorcycles, scooters, bikes, etc., is a pretty clear indication of something. I’m guessing it’s that they fear for their personal safety. Scooters might work for some folks, but let’s not suggest that it would be “easy” to switch for any significant portion of commuters.

   Carter Rubin
   Contributor, The Source

8. “Also, look at average trip length and average fare paid, as well as the average cost of driving, and put your math into context.”

   “A good car insurance….”

   “I would encourage you to use the AAA’s standard for calculating the cost of operating a car…”

   I think this is the whole point. When someone brings in a good argument that public transit isn’t worth it for shorter trips, the immediate reaction is comparison with a car. Maybe this shows that the debators can’t get over the automobile centric culture themselves either.

   When comparing at shorter distances, the car is not the only option.

   People can walk and bike. You can’t beat free against $900/year. I’d rather pay free than $900/year.

   People can motorcycle and scooter. You can’t beat something that is exempt from expensive smog checks, maintenance is cheap as googling “how do I change the oil on my scooter” on Youtube, where they get a fuel efficiency rating of 50-100 MPG, a good motorcycle insurance that averages $100 a year, and for the most part of LA, parking is free for motorcycles (LAX for example, gives free parking to motorcyclists).

   The truth is, $900/year on public transit when looking at the short distance market, is a rip-off. A lot more cheaper option exists, and increasing number of Angelinos are waking up to that fact. It doesn’t take much to notice that when I see 30+ motorcycle riders on my way to work everyday and beginning to see an average of 2-5 motorcycles and scooters at the parking lot of my supermarket everytime I go there when there used to be next to nothing just five years ago.

   In foresight, the next five to ten years, people won’t be talking about how public transit is cheaper than cars, the view will change to how motorcycles and scooters are cheaper than public transit.

9. Metro relying on AAA data as proof is a big mislead because what kind of car people drive, how they use it, and how often they maintain it varies from person to person.

   You can’t just apply the logic “your Toyota Prius, GMC Yukon and the Enzo Ferrari is the same AAA average so you’re better off taking public transit.” It’s not a great way to convince people because individual car use varies from person to person.

   The better way to do it is provide a fillable form on Metro like how banks calculate mortagages:

   “Are you better off commuting with a car or taking Metro? Let’s find out by filling out this simple questionaire:”

   How many days in a year do you work? [enter # of work days in a year = let input = A]

   How many miles do you commute to work each day? [enter one way distance here, let input = B]

   What is the average MPG of your car? [enter average MPG of car here, let input = C]

   What was your total insurance cost last year? [enter annual insurance cost for your car here, let input = D]

   What was your maintenance cost last year? [enter maintenance cost from last year, let input = E]

   What did you pay in vehicle registration fees and if applicable, smog check fees last year? [enter license fees from last year, let input = F]

   After all that’s entered, spill out the average cost to travel per mile on your car at today’s national gas average. If need be, the person can also have a manual setting to adjust the price of gas at $4/gal, $4.50/gal, $5.00/gal:

   (((A x 2B)/C) x national gas average)+D+E+F = total cost of driving a car last year
   If total cost of driving a car last year > $900/year for a monthly passes
   The person is better off taking public transit.

   This form is much better way to figure out if people are better off driving or taking public transit, AND it also gives Metro a good data input to find the average distance commuters in L.A. are driving their cars with to decide whether flat rate makes any sense or not.

   Such a form can be done with basic simple HTML coding.

   So why can’t Metro provide a tool that does this on their website and instead, opt to rely on something vague like AAA data as “proof?”

   Or is it they have something to hide that they know they are just ripping off the poor and uneducated? If they have nothing to hide, all they have to do is provide people with a inputtable form like this on Metro.net to see whether the person that is doing the inputting are actually getting a good deal over taking Metro.

10. I highly doubt people in America can easily switch to motorcycles/scooters to the extent that they’re used in Taiwan. You have to consider how tiny Taiwan is – the entire island practically fits into Los Angeles County. Space is extremely limited, which makes parking cars difficult, and everything is close together, so people are used to scooters as their main form of transport. The lifestyle also encourages the use of scooters: there is less of the whole “buying in bulk” practice that is much more prevalent (and car-necessary) here, so most families tend to drop by the market every day and pick up groceries as necessary. It helps that shops/markets are everywhere and most are open 24/7.

    I agree that in urban centers the use of scooters may be on the rise, particularly among young, single people. But with families, if the choice is between a car + transit or scooter + transit, car + transit would win. If you’re lucky enough to have a car and scooter, well, you probably wouldn’t be taking transit in the first place. And if all you’ve got is transit, chances are getting a scooter isn’t going to be high on your priority list. You’re either making transit work (perhaps with a bicycle) or aiming to buy a car (because let’s face it, if you own large pets or have kids who play sports or have elderly grandparents you need to escort around town, a scooter’s not going to cut it here).

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